simple oil question

[KarlS]

When I bought my 83VR in December I had no idea what oil was being used in it. I changed it using 20w50 Valvoline regular motorcycle oil. I would like to chance to synthetic oil. In the past when I tried to use synthetic oil in cars that had some miles on them they leaked oil quite badly. My 83 has 48000 miles in it. Do you think it would be safe to go to synthetic?

[Ndiaz]

If I were you, I wouldn't bother changing to synthetic. If your Venture runs fine on the stuff you already use, then stick to it and don't stress over needless things.

 

On my 88 VR, which I've been riding for one year, I use 10W40 Castrol petroleum oil. I change it every 2000 to 2500 miles. It does the job. Will changing to synthetic make my engine run better? It may, but it already runs so well, so...why chance a leak?

 

I once thought about doing the same thing to my Venture -- changing to synthetic. I figured it isn't worth the risk. So I ride, rather than worry...

[Monty]

Same here. I'm not a big fan of synthetics. I changed over to Rotella 15w40 Dino oil, and my Venture shifts smoother and seems to run quieter.

[MasterGuns]

I recently picked up an 86 VR and same thing; didn't know what oil had been used previously. This bike clunked when shifting even with 20/50 dino. Finally changed to Amsoil 20/50 and now smooth as silk and no leaks. If u run in extremely hot weather as I do here in Texas, 108 yesterday, I'd at least try using synthetic. In my opinion, if you develop a leak right after adding synthetic to your crankcase, a leak is a leak regardless of the oil used and needs to be addressed. If the bike had started leaking due to synthetic, I'd find and repair the leak, rather than changing back to dino. Synthetic is a much better oil in high temp conditions.

[Tom]

I doubt it will leak..Ive seen it changed in high mileage bikes and none leaked. Autos,high mileage YES. I like MasterGuns use 20/50 in our HOT Texas climate. Yes Synthetic.

[steve crossley]

changing to syn. it is not going to cause a leak dont buy in to that old line! it will however offer you the best oil you can put in your engine. it will be a lot smoother shifting .a more silent runner. the best friction fighter. the best in high temps. my 86 vr has 134.000 miles on it dosnt burn or use a drop of oil it s a few bucks more and well worth it . have you priced any engine or trans. parts lately . all hail synthetc.

[Squidley]

If I were you, I wouldn't bother changing to synthetic. If your Venture runs fine on the stuff you already use, then stick to it and don't stress over needless things.

 

On my 88 VR, which I've been riding for one year, I use 10W40 Castrol petroleum oil. I change it every 2000 to 2500 miles. It does the job. Will changing to synthetic make my engine run better? It may, but it already runs so well, so...why chance a leak?

 

I once thought about doing the same thing to my Venture -- changing to synthetic. I figured it isn't worth the risk. So I ride, rather than worry...

 

Same here. I'm not a big fan of synthetics. I changed over to Rotella 15w40 Dino oil, and my Venture shifts smoother and seems to run quieter.

 

 

 

I have used both these oils and they are great to use. I wouldn't switch to the synthetics, you will start to leak, I had that happen on my 1st '86 and just went back over to the dead dinosaurs.....dont waste your time.

 

 

Steve,

I dont know about all cases, but everyone that I have done or personally seen done has turned out the same, they leaked oil. This could have been the fact that the condition of the gaskets were less than perfect, and on a 20+ year old machine that is usually the case. Synthetics are great tools, but proper oil changes on any machine will extend the life of any engine.

[Jrichard]

That's a NEGITIVE on the switch from dino to syn. w/48K------the syn. WILL seek out the weakest spot on the gaskets:and it will leak!-------U can do a dino change ever 4k and w/ no problemo-----ONE of our Ilustrious members-----changed to syn. from dino{the gaskets started leaking! SOOOOOOO-----said member drained the syn. and PUT back the OLD dino to replug the gaskets} it worked--------no mo leaks!!---------:usa: carry on-----------

[KarlS]

I'm sticking to good ole oil. Thanks for every ones input.

[bobcat]

For what its worth...I've used Castrol GTX 20-50 for years..I change oil every 2000 miles and add about 1/3 of a container of STP with each oil change...I have no reason to change this routine..I've never had an oil related problem and that includes leaks..

[Yammer Dan]

For what its worth...I've used Castrol GTX 20-50 for years..I change oil every 2000 miles and add about 1/3 of a container of STP with each oil change...I have no reason to change this routine..I've never had an oil related problem and that includes leaks..

 

Thats what I use with same resaults. But I only change about every 3500. I have had some leaks on older bikes.

 

I've also heard STP is a bad thing for our bikes??

[Smitty161]

Again for what it is worth.....I too have a '83. I called Mobil 1 direct to ask the same question about synthetic oil. Told by Mobil not to use it due to the incapatibility with the older gasket material. They stated that should I tear down the motor and replace gaskets with newer ones then I could go ahead and use synthetic.

 

$0.02

[bobcat]

Thats what I use with same resaults. But I only change about every 3500. I have had some leaks on older bikes.

 

I've also heard STP is a bad thing for our bikes??

 

About 20 years ago a chemical engineer told a group of us (bikers) that oil starts to break down at about the 2000 mile mark so if you changed your oil every 2k then you would get the optimum use from that oil....It may be BS but I have followed that advise ever since...

Also, I have used STP, or a similiar product, for years in all my vehicles...I believe the hype that oil will maintain a higher viscosity for a longer period of time by adding STP..I've NEVER suffered any type of ill effect by using it and I swear it helps the bike shift smoother....

[dynodon]

There is no such thing as a "simple" oil question as you have found out.

 

Disclaimer, I am an Amsoil dealer, but don't do it for money, I buy for myself and sell to a few friends.

 

The old mechanics tale of synthetics causing leaks is just that, and OLD tale, and here is the straight scoop on why: When synthetics were first used during WWII, almost all oil was paraffin based, and didn't have detergents. Wars kick forward technology, and synthetics protected better and cleaned better so Amsoil started selling synthetics after the war, and they were among the first oils to have detergent. Up to that point, the paraffin based oil would gunk up the inside of engines so much that they would destroy themselves. those deposits though, would get around the old leather and real rubber gaskets used at the time and reduce some leaks. When synthetics with detergents came out, they cleaned up some of that gunk, and leaks started.

 

Today, there are no more leather and real rubber seals, and even cork is almost never used. Oil also almost never contains paraffin, and engines stay cleaner, but ALL oils now have detergents. Don't know why someone at Mobil 1 would say an 83 engine isn't compatible, but it is. There are uninformed people spreading false info everywhere. Maybe some of you will think I am, but all I can say is I didn't start using synthetics till I did my research. I used Mobil 1 for many years, and finally went with Amsoil, but Mobil 1 and Valvoline and most other synthetics are quite good, I just feel Amsoil has the best additive package.

 

Synthetics will let a new engine break in just fine, and I have lots of examples of older cars going to synthetic for the first time, and leaks slowing and oil use slowing. My own '89 SHO with 80,000 miles went from a quart in 3000 to a quart in 5000 after switching to synthetic. No new leaks.

 

Synthetic remains thicker and protects better at high temperatures, so it is logical that it would leak less. Regular oil turns to water, and synthetic also is thin at high temps, but it retains its viscosity better, thus provides better oil pressure and leaks past seals less.

 

You can switch back and forth from synthetic to regular without problems in fact "blends" that many use are just that a blend of regular and synthetic. I don't use them because you don't get the full benefit of synthetic or the price break of regular.

 

Is using regular oil and changing it at recommended intervals treating your engine good? Of course, using a synthetic is proven to reduce wear/tear, but over the life of an engine it is hard to tell, but the benefit is there. Especially in racing, motorcycle, and long life vehicles, I prefer synthetic, knowing I am getting the best protection. I tend to keep cars for well over 100,000 miles.

 

Just trying to stop these persistent "old mechanics (false) tales".

[Monty]

My problem with synthetics is that they "bond" to all metal parts better.(that's what they advertise anyway). Some even say that the oil stays attached to all moving parts, so that the parts will still be lubed on startup, reducing wear. Some have even drained all of the oil out of an engine, and ran it for several minutes with no oil in it, to show how well it bonds to metal.

 

My problem is this...

 

That means the oil also "bonds" to all of the metal shavings in your engine, and keeps them attached to your metal parts, instead of the bottom of your pan. This also means that, upon draining the oil, the shavings stay up in the engine with the "bonding" oil, instead of being able to be drained out.

 

Take it for what it's worth. That is just my own personal opinion, and it's why I don't use synthetics.

 

Both of my Ford trucks have almost 300k on them, and I only use regular 10W40. Neither one uses oil yet, either.

[Yammer Dan]

Good Thread!! I still use the old Dino castrol 20/50 and probally won't change. I change it about every 3500. you can tell by the way it shifts when it needs changed I think.

 

a question while we are here. On the old engines 100k was the standard a lot of us went by on autos. 100k + we considered it done or wore out in most cases. What is the measure you go by now? with the new oils and better engines what can you expect out of one? My old Buick had 210k purred like a kitten, still roared pretty fair when asked to and didn't use enough oil between changes to notice. Wanted to see how many I could get out of that one. How long will they go now???

[Art708]

Good Thread!! I still use the old Dino castrol 20/50 and probally won't change. I change it about every 3500. you can tell by the way it shifts when it needs changed I think.

 

a question while we are here. On the old engines 100k was the standard a lot of us went by on autos. 100k + we considered it done or wore out in most cases. What is the measure you go by now? with the new oils and better engines what can you expect out of one? My old Buick had 210k purred like a kitten, still roared pretty fair when asked to and didn't use enough oil between changes to notice. Wanted to see how many I could get out of that one. How long will they go now???

+

 

I put 240,000 on a '94 Toyota Celica and I my wife has 160,000 on her '02 VW Passat, still runs like a champ.

[TexasFlyer]

Car engine life? I just changed the platinum plugs at 100k - per the Ford Windstar maintenance manual - and really picked up some pep. I change oil every 5000 and I never use oil. The engines now days are just better and live longer. Windstar is 132K and going strong. My Toy Avalon is 144K and going strong. Changed every 5k.

 

On my 83 Venture, I use the Rotella and change evry 3000... as I believe the oil begins to fail in the Texas heat (but the engine has a thermostat and temp stays right where it ought to stay) and the gears shear the molecules in a motorcycle. So what do I know? Nothing really, except the oil changes are supremely important and doing it often is better. My 83 venture manual does NOT list a "motorcycle oil", just a regular motor oil.

 

Good thread.

[KarlS]

My 89 Tarus had 280,000 miles, my 92 Pont. mini-van had 360,000 miles before they were retired. (no engine problems) and my current 95 Pont. mini-van has 240,000 miles and I NEVER change oil under 8,000 miles. 10w-30 Valvoline. And before you all start on me I was an Auto Servece Manager for 33 years and oil is a lot different then it was 20 years ago. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

 

 

Good Thread!! I still use the old Dino castrol 20/50 and probally won't change. I change it about every 3500. you can tell by the way it shifts when it needs changed I think.

 

a question while we are here. On the old engines 100k was the standard a lot of us went by on autos. 100k + we considered it done or wore out in most cases. What is the measure you go by now? with the new oils and better engines what can you expect out of one? My old Buick had 210k purred like a kitten, still roared pretty fair when asked to and didn't use enough oil between changes to notice. Wanted to see how many I could get out of that one. How long will they go now???

[Yammer Dan]

I agree oils are alot better and not jumping on you but I couldn't sleep right going 8k. I think that is too long. Same as the ones changing it 2k I think is too soon. It is what you feel safe with I think as long as you change it regular although I think 8k is pushing it a lot.. I like every 3 to 3500. How did this one start?? Wasn't it a easy oil question??

[Gearhead]

One sage old engine machinist told me that modern production methods make more precise engine parts that last longer, but the biggest difference is EFI, primarily due to the difference at cold start. Here's why: an engine runs best at or near 14.7:1 air-fuel ratio (AFR). Carbs do an OK job of maintaining this, but EFI is much more precise. At cold start, though, the drops of fuel that come out of the carb jets don't atomize properly without the heat of a hot engine and much of it goes unburned. Thus the choke, to compensate, which can bring the mixture to as low as 7:1 (twice as rich), meaning HALF of the gas is not being burned. This fuel goes out the pipe, but also washes oil off the cylinder walls, sneaks past the rings in small quantities and contributes to acid buildup in the oil. This is the primary cause of engine wear and oil breakdown. By comparison, EFI sprays the fuel out atomized already and does not rely on the heat of the engine to do this. It has a cold-start injector, but that only runs for seconds on cold start.

 

Similarly, the old 2-3000 mile oil change is no longer necessary. Nothin' wrong with it of course, but not necessary. The oils are better, but again the EFI is the major contributor.

 

Jeremy

[KarlS]

Yes It was a simple oil question, I was worried about oil leaks if I changed. As far as my comments on the millage I get on my own cars I was just answering a question. BUT look in you owners manual and see what it says about how often to change you oil and your cars.

[Yammer Dan]

Yes It was a simple oil question, I was worried about oil leaks if I changed. As far as my comments on the millage I get on my own cars I was just answering a question. BUT look in you owners manual and see what it says about how often to change you oil and your cars.

 

This is how we have fun and learn with these. But have never seen a oil question that stays simple. We always go off in several directions with them. I don't know about the leaks with the synthetics but have really been thinking about doing the same with my 85 because everyone claims improved shifting so this one is helping me also. My 85 only has 20k. I know I said I probally wouldn't but would like the longer times between changes. With the Dino oil when shifting starts to get harder it is time to change. And this usually starts around 2 to 2500k.

Edited July 7, 2009 by Yammer Dan

[Squeeze]

This is how we have fun and learn with these. But have never seen a oil question that stays simple. We always go off in several directions with them. I don't know about the leaks with the synthetics but have really been thinking about doing the same with my 85 because everyone claims improved shifting so this one is helping me also. My 85 only has 20k. I know I said I probally wouldn't but would like the longer times between changes. With the Dino oil when shifting starts to get harder it is time to change. And this usually starts around 2 to 2500k.

 

Here's my Suggestion ...

 

Dan, you won't outrun Brown Sugar with a (severe) slipping Clutch. Just stay with the Dino.

 

I agree on shifting gets a bit harder when the Oil is the End of it's Life Cycle, but if you'd take out any Slack of the Shifter Linkages, you'd be fine. Those Linkages are getting sloppy and this what makes up the Grief. Especially the Shifter Pivot is prone to have too much Slack. A good and precise turned Brass Bushing, inserted into a bigger Bore at the Shift Lever works wonder....

 

 

Disclaimer:

Just my 2 Cents of Course, I'm not going to open that Can of Worms, again !! If you disagree with my Opinion, feel free to do so, I'll keep my Opinion.

[timgray]

Here's my experience...

 

83 venture standard. I changed to Mobil 1 20w50 for trucks to make sure I did not have the Energy conserving Starburst that will mess up the clutch.

 

Shifting ended up far FAR better. and they typical whine at 55 in 5th was reduced.

 

No leaks, and it is running great. my next change will be to the same Mobil 1 because it made a huge difference in shifting smoothness.

 

That is where it will make the difference, in your transmission.