Seafoamed Plugs

[MasterGuns]

I just read with intense interest another thread about one member soliciting opinions from others about their analysis of a couple of his spark plugs. IMHO the two (?) plugs he pictured appeared quite normal to me. But during the course of that thread one member mentions (screen name slips my memory at the moment) injecting Seafoam directly into the vacuum tube on the intake. Then he states that after this treatment replacing the plugs is highly recommended. That leads me to my question. When treating suspected gunked up carbs after a scoot has set dormant for a long period of time, in other words using a high concentration of Seafoam, can this treatment be the cause of permanent sparkplug damage? I have read here that some may dump as much as a full can and even more into a full tank of gas. That seems like quite a lot to me. Others have even written they've applied 100% Seafoam into the carbs while running. I am just curious if an overuse or high concentration can be cause for damaging sparkplugs. I've used the stuff only once on my current VR because the carbs were in fact clogged somewhere and the Seafoam did absolutely nothing. I therefore removed the carb bank, dissassembled all four and had them vatted; reassembled and, whoalah; perfect. But I did not drain and replace the gas that had the high concentration of Seafoam. But I still get a slight miss, pop, cough (however we all may describe these things) at idle. I replaced all the wires and caps and the doggone thing still pops, misses, etc at idle. The carbs are a synced as close as I can get them with my Carbtune. I am now wondering if the application of Seafoam may have permanently fouled or damaged one of the plugs. Any thoughts? Oh yeah, no vacuum leaks anywhere; checked till I was blue in the face.

 

Thanks

 

Herb

[Yammer Dan]

I waste a lot of money for plugs on these things. I use the Autolite 6411 I think it is because they are a good plug and don't cost a lot when I'm tinkering with one of them.

[Venturous Randy]

I believe if you have done any heavy mix of Seafoam, you need to change your plugs. I also use the Autolite plug Dan mentioned and have for years and it is cheap and easy to change.

RandyA

[dragerman]

Some plugs may be more tolerant then others but I’m sure if you follow the Sea-Foam product instructions it should be ok. Personally I think that in general fuel additives are used excessively and without much benefit. I agree that one full can of Sea-Foam seems a little much for one tank of fuel, more is not necessarily better. If the product is going to work it should do so when used according to the manufactures instructions. Too often we look for a quick fix (understandably so) and reach for a simple solution. I believe these products have a purpose but I tend to be a little cautious as to ‘how much’ and ‘how often’ I put anything in my tank.

 

In Canada a 473ml can of Sea-Foam can cost about $12.00, it takes about 9 ½ cans to make up one CDN gallon for a total cost of $114.00. That’s the equivalent of 26 gallons of fuel! I don’t know about you but I can drive a long way on that.

Edited June 16, 2009 by dragerman

[skydoc_17]

I am going to tell this story as it pertains to the shop I own and work in where the people who ask me to work on their bikes usually want results, at a minimal cost. As I stated in the previous thread, twice, there are times when Seafoam does a fine job, for the purpose it was intended for. It is certainly not a "wonder cure" and it will not replace the removal and complete cleaning of a set of Carbs. on a VR. As I also stated, the plugs indicated to me that the Injection of Seafoam into the intakes was not warranted and that I usually reserve that treatment for high mileage bikes. The comment I made about the plugs needing to be changed was due to the fact that when the carbon deposits are removed from the valve stems they collect on the end of the plug and insulate the electrode, making it harder for the spark plug to function properly. In the first post I made, I asked the owner of the bike in question a series of questions, and made NO MENTION of Injecting Seafoam into the Intake Ports. It was only when another member asked me to expand my explanation of this treatment did I direct my response at him personally.

In my opinion, The bottom line here is if you brought your bike to my shop with a complaint about performance issues, with vague symptoms, and no definite problems, I would try a few "low Dollar" fixes first, to try to "squeak" those last few HP from an engine that has a few miles on it or has been poorly maintained. If you came into my shop and asked me to remove, clean, and replace the Carbs. on your motorcycle I would be more than happy to do so... TO THE TUNE OF ABOUT $200.00 IN LABOR!

I consider spark plugs to be perishable items much like oil and filters. To the naked eye, can the average person tell if a spark plug is defective? For the few dollars it takes to replace that plug or filter at the going Dealer shop rate of $45.00 an hour +/- a few bucks, do you REALLY WANT a mechanic staring at one of your plugs for 15 minutes at $45.00 an hour?

As with many posts of a somewhat technical nature, portions of the post are taken and used out of context, with no mention of the information that was prior to the portion taken out of context. This is not the first time I have witnessed "nay sayers" to a mod or a procedure I use regularly, and there is a BIG DIFFERENCE between working on someone's motorcycle for hire, where you are responsible for the results and the customer's equipment as apposed to just "tinkering" with your own bike because for what ever reason you choose not to take it to a reputable mechanic. As a few of the members here know for a FACT, I invite any member to bring there bike to my shop, and you will get the very best service I can provide, for a minimum of cost, and I stand behind every repair I make. I personally would not go to a surgeon and expect him to allow me to "direct" the operation, after all, he is the specialist. As I have said many times, if you don't feel "warm and fuzzy" about any mod or procedure I talk about on this forum, You are perfectly within your right to not try it. My father told me a long, long time ago, "son, some people get it, some people don't".

I hope this puts things into perspective for anyone that has been following the previous thread.

My name is Earl Harrell and I am more that willing to chat about anything I have found out about the Yamaha Venture, and Royale.

[jasonm.]

what $45 / hour. Hell they get $75+/hr. by me. They would charge $500 minimum on a 1st gen. Venture to do such a job where I am. You wonder why they are going out of business by me? I do all my own work. It may take me 2 tries to get it perfect. I buy whatever special tool I may need for the job. May only use that tool once. But I always come out saving $$$. And at least I did not get raped.

[Yammer Dan]

Guess I'll use my two grey cells and figure it out myself. Sure can't afford to get someone else to do it at those prices!! Maybe I should get a skateboard!!!

[MasterGuns]

I have convinced myself of this. When I first brought home this 86 after it had been hibernating for an extended period of time, it ran like crap. Put new NGKs in and for a few minutes it ran somewhat better, but not a lot. Added a can of Seafoam and it seemed not to run better and as a matter of fact, after several attempts at "blowing it out" on the interstate it got progressively worse. So, resorted to pulling the carbs for a really good cleaning, inside and out. Replaced the carbs, synced the carbs several times, replaced the wires and caps. A tremendous amount of improvement but still missed, coughed, spurtered, etc, at idle. Well tonight I installed another set of NGKs and bingo, doesn't miss a beat, at idle, cold/hot, and throughout the entire rpm range. My conclusion, Seafoam damaged plugs. I am convinced of that anyway. Thanks to another thread I read today, I'd had never thought that the plugs were bad, heck they only had about 200 miles on them. Some might say I purchased a faulty plug or two but what's the chance of that?

[Yammer Dan]

I have convinced myself of this. When I first brought home this 86 after it had been hibernating for an extended period of time, it ran like crap. Put new NGKs in and for a few minutes it ran somewhat better, but not a lot. Added a can of Seafoam and it seemed not to run better and as a matter of fact, after several attempts at "blowing it out" on the interstate it got progressively worse. So, resorted to pulling the carbs for a really good cleaning, inside and out. Replaced the carbs, synced the carbs several times, replaced the wires and caps. A tremendous amount of improvement but still missed, coughed, spurtered, etc, at idle. Well tonight I installed another set of NGKs and bingo, doesn't miss a beat, at idle, cold/hot, and throughout the entire rpm range. My conclusion, Seafoam damaged plugs. I am convinced of that anyway. Thanks to another thread I read today, I'd had never thought that the plugs were bad, heck they only had about 200 miles on them. Some might say I purchased a faulty plug or two but what's the chance of that?

 

 

Way back there I bought a set of Champions for a early 60's 445 Wildcat. Car would hardly run after I gave it complete tune-up. Thought i had goofed on points or wiring or something like that. Had three bad plugs out of eight. might have been my first gray hair!!!

[Gearhead]

My conclusion, Seafoam damaged plugs.

 

Were there visible deposits on the plugs? That would be the normal mechanism of Seafoam "ruining" plugs - loosening deposits that end up on the plugs.

 

I've experienced plugs (not brand new ones) that looked just fine but in fact misfired. Only one time, on a friend's 240Z. TWO out of six were misfiring! Boy did that car fly with new plugs installed!

 

Glad your scoot is back in tip-top shape.

 

Jeremy

[Redneck]

I have convinced myself of this. When I first brought home this 86 after it had been hibernating for an extended period of time, it ran like crap. Put new NGKs in and for a few minutes it ran somewhat better, but not a lot. Added a can of Seafoam and it seemed not to run better and as a matter of fact, after several attempts at "blowing it out" on the interstate it got progressively worse. So, resorted to pulling the carbs for a really good cleaning, inside and out. Replaced the carbs, synced the carbs several times, replaced the wires and caps. A tremendous amount of improvement but still missed, coughed, spurtered, etc, at idle. Well tonight I installed another set of NGKs and bingo, doesn't miss a beat, at idle, cold/hot, and throughout the entire rpm range. My conclusion, Seafoam damaged plugs. I am convinced of that anyway. Thanks to another thread I read today, I'd had never thought that the plugs were bad, heck they only had about 200 miles on them. Some might say I purchased a faulty plug or two but what's the chance of that?

I doubt that the sea foam did any damage to your spark plugs. It is much more likley that the poor fuel mixture along with all the carbon that came loose and went through the combustion chambers when you started running the hibernated engine did the damage. It is also possible you got a defective plug. I have run many cans of sea foam through many engines and never had a problem with the plugs.The plugs in my rsv have over 20k on them and have digested several cans of sea foam and are still runnung fine.

[jasonm.]

I run Berryman's carb cleaner because the main ingredient is acetone which is another word for paint/varnish remover. ANd not made to remove heavy carbon. That's what the crud in you carbs is...petroleum varnish.

[a1bummer]

I run Berryman's carb cleaner because the main ingredient is acetone which is another word for paint/varnish remover. ANd not made to remove heavy carbon. That's what the crud in you carbs is...petroleum varnish.

 

Why wouldn't you want to remove the carbon deposits? Carbon deposits restrict airflow. Kind of like how cholesterol deposits in the arteries restricts blood flow. If you restrict blood flow to the heart, it can't operate as efficiently. If you restrict the air flow to the engine, it also doesn't perform as efficiently.

[Jrichard]

what $45 / hour. Hell they get $75+/hr. by me. They would charge $500 minimum on a 1st gen. Venture to do such a job where I am. You wonder why they are going out of business by me? I do all my own work. It may take me 2 tries to get it perfect. I buy whatever special tool I may need for the job. May only use that tool once. But I always come out saving $$$. And at least I did not get raped.

DAMN: 45 per/hr??? what a deal!!!! in Northern VA. it's $$$*(89}:mo money::usa: If I have any probs. will b sure to head yere way:sun1: