Ignition switch failure

[jrcain32]

I have a few questions about the "ignition switch failure". First, let me say mine has not failed. I'm just preparing in case it does. I would like to do the bypass of the switch but before I do I would like to ask a couple of questions.

 

Can you have the bypass wired with a toggle switch ready to use and still start the bike with the key and start button as if the bypass was not there? I have read where some have the bypass in their saddle bag ready in case the failure occurs while on the road. Why not have it in place ready to use if needed?

 

How does the bypass work? I understand all power, except the radio, is lost when you have a failure. Once toggled and power is restored, is the key and start button still used to start the bike? I would assume so but if I knew for sure I would not ask. If not please expalin the starting procedure.

 

When you read this and laugh just know I am ignorant when it comes to this kind of stuff, so go easy on me with your replies. Thanks...

[slick97spirit]

I'm right there with you man. I'm dumb as a stump when it comes to electrical issues.

[Stoutman]

This is essentially what I did with mine. I use a keyless ignition switch that bypasses the ignition switch with a sensor that looks for a smart card in my wallet. When I get on the bike the smart card reader allows me to turn on the bike with the push of a button. Push the button without the smart card in the vicinity and nothing happens. I wired this system in exactly like the instructions in the tech library say to wire in the ignition bypass. I can use my key if the system fails. I know this because I disabled the system and was able to turn the bike on with the key.

 

There are only two holes I can see in your plan. One is the lack of security. It may not be a big deal depending on how you do the install.

 

The other one is a caution, and this happened to me. If you don't need your key to ride, you may leave home without it. Then when you run low on gas and you are far enough away from home that you won't make it back, you have a problem. I was lucky and made it home on fumes.

[Monsta]

You're not allowed to post with cool thingd such as "smart cards" without giving more details! Please repost so that all may revel in the coolness of YOUR high-tech electronic gadgetry.

 

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I, too, do not understand why someone would carry a bypass switch and not install it. You have to remove the tank to gain access to the wires. NOT something I'd want to do on the side of the road.

 

My bypass switch is wired up and I se it daily until I can repair my switch. My switch still works but it only goes to RUN when strategically placed between ACC and RUN. One bump and it could turn off so I wired up the switch.

 

The switch simply bypasses the RUN part of the key switch. You still start it with the start button. The Key position is irrelevant when the switch is depressed. However, if the key isn't turned to at least ACC you won't have radio functions.

 

I tried to bypass the entire key switch so that my switch would turn on everything at once but that didn't work. Not sure why but I must have not considered one of the wires is a ground or something.

[Rick Butler]

That's pretty cool,Stout,

 

Could you give us more information on this smart card sytem?

 

But my plan is to wire up a relay to create this by-pass....with one addition. I think if you wired in a switch in the relay trigger circuit, you could create a security cut-off to where the bike could not be started even with the key, when the switch was off.

 

Rick

[wizard]

Huh?

[midnightsunrider]

That's pretty cool,Stout,

 

Could you give us more information on this smart card sytem?

 

But my plan is to wire up a relay to create this by-pass....with one addition. I think if you wired in a switch in the relay trigger circuit, you could create a security cut-off to where the bike could not be started even with the key, when the switch was off.

 

Rick

 

Maybe wire it in with a hidden in-line fuse. Then keep the fuse in the trunk or saddle bag pocket. If you ever need the by pass just instal the fuse and off you go. Simple security.

[BradT]

Even if someone used the bypass switch you will still need the key to start the bike. That is if you only bypass the 10 ga wires. It will crank over but not fire up.

 

Someone would have to take the tank off and jumper the other wire as well before they could actually start the bike.

 

The bypass wire just sends power around the switch (in laymans terms). THe heavy wire carries most of the load on it burns up the switch contacts.

 

Brad

[Squeeze]

Why would i mount a Bypass Switch in foreseeing Problems in the Future and not mount a Main Power Relay to take the Burden off the existing Main Switch ?

 

 

In Case the Main Switch passes out i could easily short wire the Relay and have everything back to working.

 

This would be the best Improvement.

[Stoutman]

Here is a writeup to the system I use. I bought mine used from a guy that couldn't figure it out so I didn't pay the retail price.

 

http://www.ironworksmotorcycle.com/VTwinExpo2006.htm

 

One caution here. The article says they used the 3M scotch locks. I don't recommend these for ANY reason. They are very unreliable and will only give you grief (that was what the guy that sold this system to me used, and I suspect that may have been his only problem.) If you can't use a crimp tool, or solder and heat shrink, get somebody that can.

 

You could do something similar to this without the expense by substituting a couple of relays to handle the power for the bikes ignition and accessories, then turn the relays on via a hidden toggle switch. That is what I did at first to figure out how to do the wiring. Once that was in place I substituted my ARSE system for the toggle switch. If you use the right type of connectors you can make everything plug into the Yamaha wiring system so there is no need to cut and splice any wires. That makes things cleaner if you should ever sell the beast.

 

Just be sure to pocket your key so you can open your gas tank, before you leave home on a long trip.

[Stoutman]

Maybe wire it in with a hidden in-line fuse. Then keep the fuse in the trunk or saddle bag pocket. If you ever need the by pass just instal the fuse and off you go. Simple security.

 

I like this idea. Another way would be to wire in the switch with a hidden two wire trailer type connector so you can keep the switch in the saddle bag and only get it out if you need to plug it in and use it.

[BradT]

Why would i mount a Bypass Switch in foreseeing Problems in the Future and not mount a Main Power Relay to take the Burden off the existing Main Switch ?

This would be the best Improvement.

 

This makes the most sense.

 

Brad

[99silver]

This makes the most sense.

 

Brad

Ditto, on what Squeeze said.

[Midnight V-4]

I tried the link for the write-up and I only got to the V-twin expo. Do you have any other info on the system you used. I have spent hours on the net trying to find a suitable system.

Thanks

[Rick Haywood]

My switch has been out since about a month after I bought the bike used, I wired the bypass in with a switch just like the one for the road/passing lights. I then drill a little hole in the plastic piece that goes atound the gas cap and mounted it in the front facing forward. You can not see it and you still have to have the key on and the switch on for it to start. And yes it does start with the push button starter switch on the right handle bar grip. I bought a used igniyion switch to put in the bike and then thought why put it in just to have problems again. So i put the switch up for when I get rid of the bike someday and then whoever I sell it to I will explain why I have it wired the way I do and leave it up to them if they want me to put the switch in. To me it makes no sense to spend $200 on a new switch when it will also go out some day. You can not see my little button plus you still need the key to start it. All it will do is turn over with just the button on. I carried the by pass switch and wires with me just in case it went out on the road but I figured I new more than you guys and mine wouldn't go out and of course it did at a stop light in the middle of traffic. You guys are like when I was a kid the older I got the smarter my Dad got. Now the longer I know you guys the smarter you all get:)

[Kirby]

My switch has been out since about a month after I bought the bike used, I wired the bypass in with a switch just like the one for the road/passing lights. I then drill a little hole in the plastic piece that goes atound the gas cap and mounted it in the front facing forward. You can not see it and you still have to have the key on and the switch on for it to start. And yes it does start with the push button starter switch on the right handle bar grip. I bought a used igniyion switch to put in the bike and then thought why put it in just to have problems again. So i put the switch up for when I get rid of the bike someday and then whoever I sell it to I will explain why I have it wired the way I do and leave it up to them if they want me to put the switch in. To me it makes no sense to spend $200 on a new switch when it will also go out some day. You can not see my little button plus you still need the key to start it. All it will do is turn over with just the button on. I carried the by pass switch and wires with me just in case it went out on the road but I figured I new more than you guys and mine wouldn't go out and of course it did at a stop light in the middle of traffic. You guys are like when I was a kid the older I got the smarter my Dad got. Now the longer I know you guys the smarter you all get:)

 

Uhhh, I resemble that remark!!

[Condor]

I just went poking around in the tech section and didn't see anything that's related to the ignition by-pass on a 2ndGen. Maybe someone should take some pics and write something up?? I didn't do an in depth search so if it's already been done a link would help....

[Carbon_One]

I just went poking around in the tech section and didn't see anything that's related to the ignition by-pass on a 2ndGen. Maybe someone should take some pics and write something up?? I didn't do an in depth search so if it's already been done a link would help....

 

Here ya go --- http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=512

[dingy]

The thread below has a PDF file attached that shows the circuit schematics before and after to complete the RSV ignition bypass that carbon_one linked to in the previous post.

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=43150

It is the last three pages in this PDF file that deal with the switch mod.

Gary

[Condor]

Here ya go --- http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=512

 

Thanks. I knew I could depend on youse guys... Looks pretty simple. Since mine going is a sure thing, like death and taxes, I think I'll install a hidden toggle and be ready for the big day.

[Carbon_One]

Thanks. I knew I could depend on youse guys... Looks pretty simple. Since mine going is a sure thing, like death and taxes, I think I'll install a hidden toggle and be ready for the big day.

Ya me too. That's why I was looking for the thread.

Larry

[Midnight V-4]

I'm sorry, I was looking for info on the "Smart Card" system mentioned by Stoutman. I've already installed a relay to take most of the current away from the ignition switch. The link in his post goes to Ironhorse v-twins and I couldn't find any info on the suystem he used.

 

I would like to install a system similar to that used by H-D. Their system uses a fob carried on the person of the rider that allows the engine to start when the rider is within a certain distance of the bike (I believe).

 

I want to add an additional layer of security for those times when I have to park in ideal conditions.

 

Thanks

[DanC]

error:no-no-no:The "best solution" to the ignition switch problem in my opinion is a simple ONE rule to follow. The Bike's ignition switch/circuit was "designed" to carry a certain amount of current through the ignition Switch. When you add accessories: ie, extra lights, radios, running light, side lights,trailer lights and etc they should all be run on a "seperate independent electrical systems". Think about this people, if you put to many circuits on a circuit breaker in your home it pops to both save the items being powered ,the circuit breaker, because of "HEAT" being generated by overloading the circuit or worse yet a fire. Do not run additional operational add ons to the ignition switch circuit. Suggestion: Go to any boat supply parts, like WEST MARINE and get a small circuit panel/strip used on boats. Run the new items installed on your bike directly from the small circuit panel/strip with each individually fused and with its own switch to control the circuit operation. This will prevent the HEAT being generated in the Key switch/circuit and thus prevents damage to the switch itself. In simple terms DO NOT add any additional items on the Key circuit switch. Treat this power going through the ignition switch just like you would any circuit breaker in your house. They are rated for a certain amount of AMPS/HEAT so you do not overload the individual circuit and cause a fire or damage the circuit breaker or to the ignition switch itself. HEAT generated by AMPS drawned by any circuit is the cause of most electrical problems in any electrical system. Computers, household items and etc. "HEAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Every system added on to your bike should be independent of the other systems currently installed. You can buy the circuit strip with the fuses already installed to the individual circuits. DanC

Edited February 10, 2011 by DanC
spelling

[Carbon_One]

I did the By-Pass procedure today and really it didn't take long or was it hard to do.

My switch is working good now but I did find that the two wire plug had gotten hot before. You could see where the plastic of the male connector had melted a bit. So hopefully there'll be no future issues.

Larry

[BradT]

Link below is an interesting post.

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=34957

 

Brad