jimmyenglish Posted April 21, 2009 #1 Posted April 21, 2009 I'm going to casually start looking for a new final drive for my 86'. It's too damn noisy. I don't want to use the 83-85 ones. I want the newest one I can find. Will the 2nd gen drives fit? Thanks. Great forum!
Squeeze Posted April 21, 2009 #2 Posted April 21, 2009 A 2Gen fianl Drive will mechanically fit and it's the same Gear Ratio. But you need to have something to Cover the Speedo Sensor Hole.
georgew48 Posted April 21, 2009 #3 Posted April 21, 2009 I have the one off my 2006 RSTD. comes complete with wheel, amost new tire and disc brake rotor. I will let it go for $150.00 plus shipping.
MiCarl Posted April 21, 2009 #4 Posted April 21, 2009 I replaced mine with the final of a 2nd Gen. I made a tear drop shaped piece of 1/4" aluminum stock to cover the hole. It is drilled at the small end to be attached by the speedo sensor mounting bolt. I put a bit of RTV around the edges of the sensor hole to seal things up. The 2nd Gen final drive is slightly narrower than the 1st gen final. It will shift the wheel about 1/4" to the left. Not a problem.
Squeeze Posted April 21, 2009 #5 Posted April 21, 2009 I replaced mine with the final of a 2nd Gen. I made a tear drop shaped piece of 1/4" aluminum stock to cover the hole. It is drilled at the small end to be attached by the speedo sensor mounting bolt. I put a bit of RTV around the edges of the sensor hole to seal things up. The 2nd Gen final drive is slightly narrower than the 1st gen final. It will shift the wheel about 1/4" to the left. Not a problem. That's a good Way to deal with the Hole. There's no Oil Pressure, so as long as it sits tight, It should stay sealed. Are you sure of this narrower Drive, never heard or seen that. iI even have a 2Gen final Drive in the Closet(in Fact should have, because i borrowed it to a Buddy) and i didn't find find anything different than all the other Pumpkins, i've had on the Bench or mounted.
MiCarl Posted April 21, 2009 #6 Posted April 21, 2009 Are you sure of this narrower Drive, never heard or seen that. iI even have a 2Gen final Drive in the Closet(in Fact should have, because i borrowed it to a Buddy) and i didn't find find anything different than all the other Pumpkins, i've had on the Bench or mounted. On the bench they both seemed the same to me too. When I went to put the cotter pin in the axle nut I noticed that the hole in the axle was beyond the castle nut. Checking the alignment as part of another exercise I did measure the rear wheel tracks about 1/4" left of the front. I didn't have any parts left over. When I was doing my research I checked and found that all the interface parts on 2nd gen were the same as 1st gen. Near as I can figure the overall pumpkin is a bit narrower to accommodate a wider wheel on the 2nd gen. That's a sharp looking plug in your picture. Mine is similar, but without the round plug part. I had thought about tapping for a pipe plug, but mine was a gift and I wanted to be able to return it if it didn't work out.
pegscraper Posted April 21, 2009 #7 Posted April 21, 2009 Speaking of a pipe plug, I wonder if there might be a freeze plug just the right size to tap into the hole and seal it off.
Squeeze Posted April 21, 2009 #8 Posted April 21, 2009 On the bench they both seemed the same to me too. When I went to put the cotter pin in the axle nut I noticed that the hole in the axle was beyond the castle nut. Checking the alignment as part of another exercise I did measure the rear wheel tracks about 1/4" left of the front. I didn't have any parts left over. When I was doing my research I checked and found that all the interface parts on 2nd gen were the same as 1st gen. Near as I can figure the overall pumpkin is a bit narrower to accommodate a wider wheel on the 2nd gen. That's a sharp looking plug in your picture. Mine is similar, but without the round plug part. I had thought about tapping for a pipe plug, but mine was a gift and I wanted to be able to return it if it didn't work out. It's very nice to have a Buddy with a Lot of CNC-Machines at his Job ... :whistling: He wants to try the longer Ratio, and have no Time to modify the Casing to fit it to a Vmax. So he said, give me that Beast and i will get it done. ... You mean the Boring for the Cotter Pin in the Axle was 1/4 Inch more outwards to the left than before ? If so, i will hear about that very soon. He's running a 200/50 ZR18 on his Max with a modfied Swingarm to accept the wider Tire. There usually are 2 or 3 mms Gap between Tire and Swingarm. If that's happening, the Tire will rub on the Swing Arm.
MiCarl Posted April 22, 2009 #9 Posted April 22, 2009 You mean the Boring for the Cotter Pin in the Axle was 1/4 Inch more outwards to the left than before ? Not 100% sure about that. My rear wheel tracks about 1/4 inch left of the front. I've got 1 degree of twist in the swing arm which moves the tire back to the right - so it might actually be a bit more than 1/4". I do no that the boring for the pin falls outside the slots on the castle nut.
Beau-Kat Posted April 22, 2009 #10 Posted April 22, 2009 I have the one off my 2006 RSTD. comes complete with wheel, amost new tire and disc brake rotor. I will let it go for $150.00 plus shipping. What a sweet deal!!! Someone oughta jump on that!
Squeeze Posted April 22, 2009 #11 Posted April 22, 2009 Not 100% sure about that. My rear wheel tracks about 1/4 inch left of the front. I've got 1 degree of twist in the swing arm which moves the tire back to the right - so it might actually be a bit more than 1/4". I do no that the boring for the pin falls outside the slots on the castle nut. I'm not sure if i understand your Comment completely. If the 2Gen final Drive is narrower than the 1Gen(which is the same Casing as the Vmax) this would put the Wheel to the Left. But with the same Wheel, Collar, Caliper Holder and Washer, this would also mean that the Axle needs to slide more into the Swingarm Boring on the right Side to accomodate Pressure on the inner Hub Parts. The Cotter Pin would fit on the same Place as it has been before. That's because the whole Assembly would be shifted to the left of the Bike. If the Cotter Pin Boring is at another Place with the 1Gen Pumpkin, it may be for another Reason. If your Bike is out of Aligment, that's another Story. They all are off for some Amount. Yamaha Germany considers 9mm(3/8") as fine. If you want to correct this, you need an adjustable Swingarm Pivot Bolt on the left Side instead of the fixed Bolt and mostly a longer Bolt on the right Side. But I'm not sure how this would work out with the Suspension Parts. It works on the Vmax, though.
MiCarl Posted April 22, 2009 #12 Posted April 22, 2009 If the 2Gen final Drive is narrower than the 1Gen(which is the same Casing as the Vmax) this would put the Wheel to the Left. But with the same Wheel, Collar, Caliper Holder and Washer, this would also mean that the Axle needs to slide more into the Swingarm Boring on the right Side to accomodate Pressure on the inner Hub Parts. The Cotter Pin would fit on the same Place as it has been before. That's because the whole Assembly would be shifted to the left of the Bike. The whole assembly does shift to the left, except the castle nut. It's tight against the outside of the final drive. That's why the hole for the cotter pin is above the top of the nut. Of course I found all this at the end of assembly on a really nice riding day, so I just left it. Next time I have it apart I'll double up on the washer outside the caliper carrier to pull the axle back to the right and let the cotter pin do it's job.
Squeeze Posted April 22, 2009 #13 Posted April 22, 2009 Mostly likely, Part #5 COLLAR, GUIDE 4YE-46153-00-00 in the Diagram is crushed.
Venturous Randy Posted April 22, 2009 #14 Posted April 22, 2009 Mostly likely, Part #5 COLLAR, GUIDE 4YE-46153-00-00 in the Diagram is crushed. I doubt that, as it looks like you would have some serious gear mesh if it was crushed. I suspect any differences would be on the outside of the unit. Just out of curosity, did the same axle get used on both rear ends? If not, are they the same lengths? Also, has the width on the rear end been measured? Are the fork leg thicknesses the same on the bikes the parts came from? Enquireing minds want to know. RandyA
Squeeze Posted April 22, 2009 #15 Posted April 22, 2009 I doubt that, as it looks like you would have some serious gear mesh if it was crushed. I suspect any differences would be on the outside of the unit. Just out of curosity, did the same axle get used on both rear ends? If not, are they the same lengths? Also, has the width on the rear end been measured? Are the fork leg thicknesses the same on the bikes the parts came from? Enquireing minds want to know. RandyA Nope Randy, this Collar goes all the Way through the the Casing and the Output Gear/Spline and is the Part which the inner Race of the Bearing attaches to. A bit complicated Despricption, but that the Way it is. The Axles connects following Parts from right to left: Swing Arm, Washer, Caliper Bracket, right Collar, inner Race Ball Bearing, Flange, Spacer, inner Race Needle Bearing, and finally the Collar #5. If the Collar #5 is crushed, nothing happens except the Wheel is sitting more left than ususal. There is some extra Space in the Meshing of Wheel Hub and Output Gear, so this doesn't hurt anything. http://www.flatoutmotorcycles.com/fiche_image_popup.asp?fveh=327§ion=13456&year=1989&make=Yamaha&category=Motorcycles&dc=1620&name=REAR+WHEEL Fork Legs Diameter are all the same on 1Gen - 41 mm at 825mm Length from Axle Center to Top. http://www.flatoutmotorcycles.com/fiche_image_popup.asp?fveh=4522§ion=198926&year=1983&make=Yamaha&category=Motorcycles&dc=1620&name=REAR+WHEEL
MiCarl Posted April 22, 2009 #16 Posted April 22, 2009 Mostly likely, Part #5 COLLAR, GUIDE 4YE-46153-00-00 in the Diagram is crushed. Could be. On the other hand that part on an 89 is 1FK-46153-00-00. I checked and it has not been superseded. How much you wanna bet the 1st gen one is 6-8mm longer? HEY! Since I'm at the shop I can just measure the 1st gen (MKII) final I took off: Laying the final drive on the bench - with the ring gear up I measure the top of the collar at 89.29mm. Flipping the final over so the splined part of the ring gear is on the bench I get overall height of 117.9mm. Didn't you say you had a 2nd gen final laying around loose? Start measuring! **EDIT** Randya, I am using the 1st gen axle.
Squeeze Posted April 22, 2009 #17 Posted April 22, 2009 Could be. On the other hand that part on an 89 is 1FK-46153-00-00. I checked and it has not been superseded. How much you wanna bet the 1st gen one is 6-8mm longer? HEY! Since I'm at the shop I can just measure the 1st gen (MKII) final I took off: Laying the final drive on the bench - with the ring gear up I measure the top of the collar at 89.29mm. Flipping the final over so the splined part of the ring gear is on the bench I get overall height of 117.9mm. Didn't you say you had a 2nd gen final laying around loose? Start measuring! **EDIT** Randya, I am using the 1st gen axle. My Buddy has it in his Shop. I will have him measure this tommorrow and report back.
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