Dragonslayer Posted February 27, 2009 #1 Posted February 27, 2009 Went to crank bike yesterday and while hitting start button I heard a diffinate sound then sound of engine turning over changed to it just turning over but no fire and start. I don't hear the clicking of the fuel pump pressurizing anymore. All fuses appear good. I'm thinking fuel pump relay failure. Any thoughts?
Ponch Posted February 27, 2009 #2 Posted February 27, 2009 I don't know if the first gen has the same ignition switch setup, but it sounds like the same symptoms as described by us second genners. Ponch
BoomerCPO Posted February 27, 2009 #3 Posted February 27, 2009 Only advice I can offer you is to BUY A 2ND GEN!!!!!!!! I hope ya find the problem tho without having to spend a lot of $$$$$$. Boomer........Who hates to see any scoot sidelined and not on the road.
Condor Posted February 27, 2009 #4 Posted February 27, 2009 Went to crank bike yesterday and while hitting start button I heard a diffinate sound then sound of engine turning over changed to it just turning over but no fire and start. I don't hear the clicking of the fuel pump pressurizing anymore. All fuses appear good. I'm thinking fuel pump relay failure. Any thoughts? Have you checked a plug for spark, and is the plug wet when you first pulled it??
mattevans Posted February 27, 2009 #5 Posted February 27, 2009 I WOULD RECOMMEND YOU PULL THE FUEL HOSE GOING FROM THE PUMP TO THE CARBS AND PLACE IT IN A CONTAINER TO SEE IF THE PUMP IS PUMPING WHILE YOU TRY AND START THE BIKE. NO FUEL WILL NARROW THE PROBLEM TO THE PUMP. I HAVE NOT HAD THIS PROBLEM BUT I WOULD ALSO GUESS THE RELAY IF YOUR NOT HEARING THE CLICKING WHEN YOU FIRST TURN THE SWITCH ON. ALSO MY FUEL FILTER IS CLEAR AND I CAN PLAINLY SEE THE FILTER FILL UP WHEN I TURN THE SWITCH ON. IF YOU ARE USING THE STANDARD YAMAHA FILTER YOURS IS PROBABLY NOT CLEAR SO YOU MAY HAVE TO REMOVE THE HOSE.
bobcat Posted February 27, 2009 #7 Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) I agree with Condor.....Seveal years ago I had the same problem...I went to start my bike and it wouldn't fire..I looked in my service manual for ideas on where to begin..Their first suggestion was to change the plugs..I thought this was a waste of time because the bike had been starting fine but I did as the book suggested just to get it out of the way.... I replaced the plugs and much to my surprise it fired right up.. SOOO....my suggestion would be to change the plugs first... Edited February 27, 2009 by bobcat
Dragonslayer Posted February 27, 2009 Author #8 Posted February 27, 2009 Kill Switch? Maybe?Checked that Kill switch in get go position
GeorgeS Posted February 27, 2009 #9 Posted February 27, 2009 Just open " one " carb bowl drain hose valve. Key to on, see if pump keeps pumping gas thru the bowl . Is Petcock in the " OFF " position ?? Check for a " Mouse Nest " near the Main Fuse Block, maby chewed off some wires !!!
PBJ Posted February 27, 2009 #10 Posted February 27, 2009 BOB, ANY CHANCE THE BATTERY IS JUST TOO WEAK TO TURN THE STARTER and GIVE YOU SPARK? OR IS IT TURNING OVER STRONG BUT JUST NOT CATCHING?
Squidley Posted February 27, 2009 #11 Posted February 27, 2009 Good ideas, but check for spark 1st. We had the same thing happen at a M&E here in Michigan and it turned out to be the kickstand switch. Had the bike half torn apart and plugs pulled, a little voice said put up the kickstand and try it. We did and it started right up.
Dragonslayer Posted February 28, 2009 Author #12 Posted February 28, 2009 BOB, ANY CHANCE THE BATTERY IS JUST TOO WEAK TO TURN THE STARTER and GIVE YOU SPARK? OR IS IT TURNING OVER STRONG BUT JUST NOT CATCHING?Battery is full charge and turning starter
Poledar Posted March 1, 2009 #13 Posted March 1, 2009 I went through that with my 1st Gen Mk II and was bailed out (with sheep faced look on my face!) by the amazing Muffinman. My choke cable had become disconnected somehow. It turned well, but would not catch. After the cable was reconnected, she fired right up and has ever since. Hope your problem is as simple! POLEDAR...
CrazyHorse Posted March 2, 2009 #14 Posted March 2, 2009 I agree with Condor.....Seveal years ago I had the same problem...I went to start my bike and it wouldn't fire..I looked in my service manual for ideas on where to begin..Their first suggestion was to change the plugs..I thought this was a waste of time because the bike had been starting fine but I did as the book suggested just to get it out of the way.... I replaced the plugs and much to my surprise it fired right up.. SOOO....my suggestion would be to change the plugs first... I did this too even though I had spark. Changed plugs fired right up.
Dragonslayer Posted March 2, 2009 Author #15 Posted March 2, 2009 I went through that with my 1st Gen Mk II and was bailed out (with sheep faced look on my face!) by the amazing Muffinman. My choke cable had become disconnected somehow. It turned well, but would not catch. After the cable was reconnected, she fired right up and has ever since. Hope your problem is as simple! POLEDAR...You know Muffinman called me and told me this story so I went and checked. Nope thats not it.
RustyRecycledToy Posted March 2, 2009 #16 Posted March 2, 2009 This happened on my '87 last summer. After several weekends of sorting through wires and connections I ended up pulling the pump off, taking it apart and cleaning it.That seemed to do the trick. Hasn't failed me since. You might give that a try. Good Luck
GeorgeS Posted March 2, 2009 #17 Posted March 2, 2009 Did you try opening the carb bowl drains, to see if pump actually pumping. Did you do a re check of the pick up coils. Take the Ohm meter readings from the 6 pin plug at the TCI. Did you check all the Throttle linkage parts, to make sure all 4 throttle plates are at the closed position Did you pull the Electrical plug OFF , of the Barrometric Pressure Sensor, Clean that plug. Try starting the engine with that plug " Removed " -- Roll Over Switch --- thats way out in Left Field, but a possibility -- ??? ( do you know what it is, and where it is ?? )
Dragonslayer Posted March 4, 2009 Author #18 Posted March 4, 2009 Did you try opening the carb bowl drains, to see if pump actually pumping. Did you do a re check of the pick up coils. Take the Ohm meter readings from the 6 pin plug at the TCI. Did you check all the Throttle linkage parts, to make sure all 4 throttle plates are at the closed position Did you pull the Electrical plug OFF , of the Barrometric Pressure Sensor, Clean that plug. Try starting the engine with that plug " Removed " -- Roll Over Switch --- thats way out in Left Field, but a possibility -- ??? ( do you know what it is, and where it is ?? )fuel pump seems to be working now after sitting for 3 days , Battery was dead again so I took battery back to battery plus. Odyssey battery less than a year will not hold a charge. fully charged it will decharge in 3 days with no load on it. The weather had been bad for the past few days so i haven,t spent much time on the bike. but the next four days is warming up into the seventies so I'll be starting into it tomorrow.
Dragonslayer Posted March 5, 2009 Author #19 Posted March 5, 2009 Did you try opening the carb bowl drains, to see if pump actually pumping. Did you do a re check of the pick up coils. Take the Ohm meter readings from the 6 pin plug at the TCI. Did you check all the Throttle linkage parts, to make sure all 4 throttle plates are at the closed position Did you pull the Electrical plug OFF , of the Barrometric Pressure Sensor, Clean that plug. Try starting the engine with that plug " Removed " -- Roll Over Switch --- thats way out in Left Field, but a possibility -- ??? ( do you know what it is, and where it is ?? )Barrometric sensor where is it? what is it?
GeorgeS Posted March 5, 2009 #20 Posted March 5, 2009 If its installed on your bike, its located, Forward , a little above, and about 3 inches of the left fwd Carb. The Vaccume line from the Lft Fwd carb runs up to it. ( the real small line. ) Electrical plug, has a rubber boot on it. You might have to remove the Lower fairing, to get your hand up in there. This item, is powered, from the 15 Amp Ing. Fuse, same circuit that powers the TCI, and Coils, and fuel pump, and few other things. Find the plug, disconnect it, and try to start the engine. What this unit does, is Vary the Ignition Timeing, based on intake vaccume changes.
Dragonslayer Posted March 5, 2009 Author #21 Posted March 5, 2009 If its installed on your bike, its located, Forward , a little above, and about 3 inches of the left fwd Carb. The Vaccume line from the Lft Fwd carb runs up to it. ( the real small line. ) Electrical plug, has a rubber boot on it. You might have to remove the Lower fairing, to get your hand up in there. This item, is powered, from the 15 Amp Ing. Fuse, same circuit that powers the TCI, and Coils, and fuel pump, and few other things. Find the plug, disconnect it, and try to start the engine. What this unit does, is Vary the Ignition Timeing, based on intake vaccume changes. I got Battries Plus to agree that my Odyssey battery was bad and would not hold a charge so they gave me a new one. I put it in the bike and charged it overnight to 13.75 volts. Tried to start it this morning and it did not start. I took the plugs out and cleaned them up and regapped them then reinstalled. After a few minutes of trying to start the bike fired with alot of smoke and ran. As the bike warmed up the smoke cleared out and then the bike seemed to run pretty good. Rode it around the block a few times until I saw a cop in the neighborhood and since I didn't have my helmet on I pulled up the drive way and parked it. shut it off and fired it a couple of times and the bike started without a problem or any smoke.
Dano Posted March 6, 2009 #22 Posted March 6, 2009 Did you put seafoam in the tank and run it for a bit when you parked it last? Could be the seafoam soaked into the ceramic insulator of the plug, shorting them out till you cleaned 'em real good. I've got a plug cleaner from Harbor Freight I use to clean my 2 stroke plugs, occasionally use it on my 4 stroke plugs. That may account for the smoke, also. But it was probably the excess fuel in the cylinders from trying to fire it up. Just a few thoughts to ponder..... Dan
bobcat Posted March 7, 2009 #23 Posted March 7, 2009 I wouldn't trust those plugs..If they failed you once then I'd be skeptical of it happening again, and you know Murphys law..it'll happen at the worst possible time...Reach down deep into your pocket and pull out $8 and buy a new set of plugs and be done with it... For what its worth...I always carry and extra set of new plugs with me just in case..
paysaw Posted October 28, 2012 #24 Posted October 28, 2012 I just picked up a new to me 84 Venture.It ran when I picked it up but would not idle.I started it up today to move it. It refused to run. Lots of battery and turns over fast.The engine was inconsistent running and the throttle is slow in response.I can here it trying to start but wont catch .Where should i start looking first?
Condor Posted October 29, 2012 #25 Posted October 29, 2012 (edited) I just picked up a new to me 84 Venture.It ran when I picked it up but would not idle.I started it up today to move it. It refused to run. Lots of battery and turns over fast.The engine was inconsistent running and the throttle is slow in response.I can here it trying to start but wont catch .Where should i start looking first? I've had that problem with a couple of new2me Ventures. I'll PM you a write up that worked for me. Edited October 29, 2012 by Condor
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