Pros & cons of ABS and linked braking systems

[dharnie]

I am curious to know what you have experienced with the ABS and/or linked braking systems (either with ABS or without) on other bikes that you have driven (since the RSV does not have linked or ABS brakes).

 

I layed my RSV down after I locked up the rear brake in an emergency situation and posted that thread here: http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=29532.

[KiteSquid]

ABS is GREAT in an Emergency!!! Well worth the cost for the manufacturer to design and install.

 

Knowing how to drive my bike at the edge of it's limits is priceless!!!!

 

I try to practice proper motorcycle driving skills every time I ride.

 

I have attended a MSF rider-course on two occasions and look forward to my next opportunity!!!!!!

 

I also have Ride Like a Pro V DVD and view it at least monthly, and consciously try to practice the skills they teach every time I go out for a ride. Head and eyes, friction zone, leaning the bike in tight turns, etc...

 

I hope that it makes me a safer rider, so I can keep my bike, my passenger and myself out of tight situations were I might have to use ABS.

 

 

I do hope the 3rd gen RSV has ABS, but the MSRP will go up about $1,500 or more just for that. Sense the 2nd Gen VMax has it, I will have assume the 3rd Gen RSV will too...

 

Oh, I have NEVER liked linked braking systems on a bike.

[sarges46]

Well...of course both my first gens had linked brakes. I loved it. Try as I might I could not lock those brakes up......

 

I have had one serious rear lock-up on my RSV and dont ever want that again. Yes, I thought I could just feather and pump the rear if I needed to...but once the big truck with the drum broom swung out in front of me....I hammered the brakes ...skidded....but something must have told me not to release the brake and I managed to get her straightened out.....did it stop me.....nope....but I was swerving right at the same time I hammered that rear brake so I missed that truck!

 

Over this winter I will be ordering Ricks brake mod. This has got to help. Would I like ABS....darn right I would.

[CrazyHorse]

My experiance with ABS has been good on HD bikes except if you hit a bump while abs is kicking in then the bike rockets foward a bit on wet or crap surfaces it has worked well. I like the fact the brakes are not linked I dont want linked brakes especially on wet, or crummy surfaces I dont want that front wheel taking me out if it happens to lock up. I dont want linked brakes in a turn where I might want a little rear brake only. I like the way BMWK1200lt does thier brakes ABS can be turned on or off if you want. Though they are linked but the reverse of most bikes the rear is linked to the front brake handle instead of the other way.

 

On the 2nd gen I know you folks have a problem with rear lock up. I think its a design flaw but I also think they way they design the rear pedal big like a cars and floor boards makes it so easy to slam on the rear brake hard. I find it much harder to slam on the rear brake on my 1st Gen with pegs and the small brake pedal (my brakes are delinked.) ABS solves the problem of rear wheel lock up. I dont think you need linked brakes. Now MC designers include this as a way of forcing you to apply both sets of brakes. So many people just use that rear brake its not even funny. I think if you had just ABS that you could turn on and off you would be fine no need for linked brakes, Just my HO.

[dharnie]

Jimbob - I like your reasoning. I thought that I read that BMW changed their linked brakes where only the front lever actuates both brakes. It makes sense. I often wondered if hitting the rear pedal would not work in the biker's favor - like you said - on a turn - if linking was actuated by the rear brake.

 

Sounds like ABS on both brakes and, if one wanted a linked system, to have it only actuated by the front lever.

[CrazyHorse]

Jimbob - I like your reasoning. I thought that I read that BMW changed their linked brakes where only the front lever actuates both brakes. It makes sense. I often wondered if hitting the rear pedal would not work in the biker's favor - like you said - on a turn - if linking was actuated by the rear brake.

 

Sounds like ABS on both brakes and, if one wanted a linked system, to have it only actuated by the front lever.

 

 

I'm sure theres alot people that would disagree with me but thats the way I feel. Hope they voice thier opinions I'd like to hear them. Most MC makers know that in panic most people hit the rear pedal like a car so its made that way.

Edited November 20, 2008 by CrazyHorse

[CrazyHorse]

Jimbob - I like your reasoning. I thought that I read that BMW changed their linked brakes where only the front lever actuates both brakes. It makes sense. I often wondered if hitting the rear pedal would not work in the biker's favor - like you said - on a turn - if linking was actuated by the rear brake.

 

 

Hitting a little rear in a turn helps stabilize the bike some.

[KiteSquid]

On the 2nd gen I know you folks have a problem with rear lock up. I think its a design flaw but I also think they way they design the rear pedal big like a cars and floor boards makes it so easy to slam on the rear brake hard.

 

IF you keep your heel on the floor board, it is much easier to control the rear brake!

[rod]

On the MSF Instructor list there was just a good discussion on this. It seemed to be a split decision over all on the ABS. On low traction quick stops the ABS shines; under normal stooping it can kick in when not needed hitting a bump or small oil patch etc.) I don't like the linked brakes, I like to use just the rear in some situations. No matter what you have practice is the best solution. I don't remember the last time I lock up the rear on my RSV. I practice all the time and I agree that leaving your heel on the floorboard helps. Rod

[CrazyHorse]

IF you keep your heel on the floor board, it is much easier to control the rear brake!

 

Yes but my experiance with HD's which is alot (never rode a2nd Gen I assume they are close in design for brakes.) I find I use more rear then I want in a panic stop so I can see where people can lock up. My thinking is the design of such a huge pedal and the general likeness to a car brake pedal makes it easy to do. I'm not really a fan of floor boards I find I use them like pegs I just use the very back edge of the board like a peg never really put my feet on the board but its something to try heal on the board.

[KiteSquid]

I think that it is like anything else, you must get used to it though practice.

 

I locked up my rear once, and that was when I was trying to make it slide!!!!!!!

 

I had to TRY try to make it slide!!!!!!!!

 

 

My first bike (Kawasaki KZ1100D) had pegs only, my second bike (H-D Heritage Classic), third (1950 H-D FL but it has drum brakes, so locking them up is next to impossible), and fourth bike (Yamaha 2nd Gen RSV) all had/have boards. I guess i am used to them through proper practice.

 

 

BUT I might lock them up in a panic stop, but I try to live what The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy says:

 

DON'T PANIC

 

When I panic, I have lost control of a situation. Being in control of whatever vehicle I am driving 100% of the time is quite important for me to get to my final destination, intact.

 

The only way I can keep from panicking is to practice the skills I need in emergency situations in a controlled environment. I learned this while in the US Navy. They would drill us to no ends on CPR, First Aid and our jobs while at General Quarters. It paid off at least once for me.

 

I accidentally cut myself BAD, and not a drop of blood hit the floor as I applied direct pressure to the wound QUICKLY!!!!! I went to sick bay to get stitched up and the Hospital Corpsman was VERY surprised when I told him how bad I cut myself but he did not see any blood on me. He instructed me to take my hand away from the wound and the blood FLOWED!!!!!

 

Once stitched up we reviewed the entire process and the only flaw we could find is how I cut myself in the first place, but all the emergency processes went so smoothly due to all the drilling I had.

 

So I try to practice quick stops every time I ride!!! I think this is why I don't lock up the rear tire.

[CrazyHorse]

I guess my ideal brake system would be a bike with non-linked brakes with ABS I can turn off when I want too. My experiance with HD ABS you brake hard and hit a bump you get a jerk foward which is unnerving but managable. I also tried in a heavy rain to skid on a HD Roadking with ABS and I couldnt get it to lose control , it worked great. On good roads I'd leave the ABS off in bad weather or crummy roads I'd have it on.

[Squeeze]

I guess my ideal brake system would be a bike with non-linked brakes with ABS I can turn off when I want too. My experiance with HD ABS you brake hard and hit a bump you get a jerk foward which is unnerving but managable. I also tried in a heavy rain to skid on a HD Roadking with ABS and I couldnt get it to lose control , it worked great. On good roads I'd leave the ABS off in bad weather or crummy roads I'd have it on.

 

You're right on, i'm absolutely with you on that.