Oil question

[Dark Wolf]

I am about to change the oil in my 83 VR, wanted to go to a synthetic but heard some have additives that hinder clutch preformance could someone please advise me which one I need to go with.

[Condor]

I am about to change the oil in my 83 VR, wanted to go to a synthetic but heard some have additives that hinder clutch preformance could someone please advise me which one I need to go with.

 

Stick to dino oil. Synthetics are great on a new engine, but on older engines it will start to leak everywhere. Make sure the oil does not have 'friction modifiers'. I've used Rotella 15-40, and Valvoline 20-50 in my '83 and they work just fine.

[jlh3rd]

agreed,

 

if the oil has an energy conserving and/or "for gasoline engines" symbol on it...i wouldn't use it in a motorcycle ........ditto for synthetics in older/ high mileage engines that weren't running synthetics ( ask me how i know ).............also, they're taking zinc out of oils for gasoline engines ,which is needed longevity for bearings, especially important for motorcycles......so, use an oil rated for diesel engines which covers all these bases...which rotella is...i believe a diesel rating is designated c-4......

[Dark Wolf]

Thanks for the responces. I assume that Yamalube is a good choice if a synthetic is not recommended.

[Dark Wolf]

I did forget to mention the bike only has 36,450 miles on it.

[Condor]

Thanks for the responces. I assume that Yamalube is a good choice if a synthetic is not recommended.

 

Sure if you want to go that route. It's kinda on the pricy side, but now days I guess they all are. I pick up Rotella a Wally World for a little over $8.00 bucks a gallon.

[DANJ]

Sure if you want to go that route. It's kinda on the pricy side, but now days I guess they all are. I pick up Rotella a Wally World for a little over $8.00 bucks a gallon.

I went from Amsoil to Yamalube last change. I immediatly noticed that the small leak I had on the left side quit and the engine seemed quieter. Clutch also better. Yamalube around here runs $30 per gallon. Next time will likley be Valv or Penz M/C 20-50. alot better price.

[dynodon]

I am a beliver in synthetics and just have to smile when I continue to hear stories about leaks. This comes from synthetics being one of the first oils ever to have detergents in them. Back when oil had a lot of parifin in it, that gunk and other crud kept old style leather and real rubber seals from leaking by plugging it up. That isn't the case anymore, and ALL regular oils and synthetics have detergents in them.

 

I can site many many cases where oil use went down because synthetics hold their viscosity and actually run thicker than regular oil. If anything, a synthetic will leak through a hole less, because it doesn't thin out as much. when sitting, if you have a hole big enough for oil to pour out of, the fact that synthetic doesn't turn to thick sludge when room temp or colder won't really effect oil drips.

 

All engines will use some oil, that is the design of an internal combustion engine. The cylinder and other moving parts are coated with oil, and some of that is burned. Some just evaporates, and synthetics are much better in this respect (won't evaporate) than regular oils.

 

Most cases of oil leaks/use increasing come from people remembering those "old mechanics tales" from when synthetics were brand new and many people fear anything new. IN most cases, you get what you expect to get.

 

Anyway, Synthetics are just fine for wet clutches (and posi units in rear ends) as long as the oil meets the specifications for the manufacturer. Stay away from "energy conserving auto oils for bikes with wet clutches.

 

Amsoil has a great new 27 page intensive study of motorcycle oils over a wide range of types of bikes, and most of the popular oils. if interested, you can call Amsoil and see if they will send you a copy. all tests were done with ASTM procedures.

[jlh3rd]

i also have to smile when i know for a fact that putting synthetics in when you've been running dino oil and someone says that it will not leak.......and it does......... three cases in point.........1975 honda 550f...notorious for head gasket seepage.......i found a beauty in 1995 with 8500 miles on it....and no seepage....rode it a little and about 2 yrs after buying it ..decided to put syn. in it..mobile one .....noticed after a few months, really leaking from the head gasket...replaced it with dino and now im not wiping oil off of the cylinders.

1987 monte carlo ss, purchased in 1999, 91,000 miles and one of the selling points was the fact that there was NO, absolutely none, leaks, seepage or signs of any oil on the bottom of the engine....ran it for a couple of years...decided to put syn. in it ..6 months later, i had leaks

2002 chevy camaro, 15,000 miles, purchased brand new, always run with mobile 1, no leaks...

now you ( and i guess amsoil, sounds like you're a dealer)..claim that its because of the detergents in syn. well there's detergent in dino oil also , so why didn't i get leaks with those oils.....now, hears what i've heard and it's not from a biased oil supplier. it comes from legit articles i've read in many car magazines ( hot rod,mechanics illustrated, super chevy etc. ) and that is.... one, the syn molecules are of uniform size and are able to move through microscopic "gaps" easier.......two, older gaskets normally swell in contact with regular oil, synthetic, because of its structure, causes less ,if no swelling........newer cars and newer gaskets reduce that effect

initially, years ago, i didn't believe the rumors........i do now because it happened, and i've read other stories..........i would not recommend putting synthetic oil in an older, higher mileage engine as you will probably develope leaks

i will agree that synthetics may do a better job of cleaning up sludge around gaskets and that may add to the leaking...........

[Condor]

i also have to smile when i know for a fact that putting synthetics in when you've been running dino oil and someone says that it will not leak.......and it does......... three cases in point.........1975 honda 550f...notorious for head gasket seepage.......i found a beauty in 1995 with 8500 miles on it....and no seepage....rode it a little and about 2 yrs after buying it ..decided to put syn. in it..mobile one .....noticed after a few months, really leaking from the head gasket...replaced it with dino and now im not wiping oil off of the cylinders.

1987 monte carlo ss, purchased in 1999, 91,000 miles and one of the selling points was the fact that there was NO, absolutely none, leaks, seepage or signs of any oil on the bottom of the engine....ran it for a couple of years...decided to put syn. in it ..6 months later, i had leaks

2002 chevy camaro, 15,000 miles, purchased brand new, always run with mobile 1, no leaks...

now you ( and i guess amsoil, sounds like you're a dealer)..claim that its because of the detergents in syn. well there's detergent in dino oil also , so why didn't i get leaks with those oils.....now, hears what i've heard and it's not from a biased oil supplier. it comes from legit articles i've read in many car magazines ( hot rod,mechanics illustrated, super chevy etc. ) and that is.... one, the syn molecules are of uniform size and are able to move through microscopic "gaps" easier.......two, older gaskets normally swell in contact with regular oil, synthetic, because of its structure, causes less ,if no swelling........newer cars and newer gaskets reduce that effect

initially, years ago, i didn't believe the rumors........i do now because it happened, and i've read other stories..........i would not recommend putting synthetic oil in an older, higher mileage engine as you will probably develope leaks

i will agree that synthetics may do a better job of cleaning up sludge around gaskets and that may add to the leaking...........

 

 

Yep, my '83VR has 50+K on it. Dry as a bone. I put in some synthetic oil, and it started to smoke from oil leaking on the exhaust. Changed back to dino and the leak stopped.

Amsoil states right on their website the older engines that have been using dino oil will develope leaks.

 

You may have heard the myth that synthetic oil can cause engine seals to leak. Synthetics absolutely do not cause seals to leak, they simply may only reveal an existing leak path and seal which has failed and is in need of mechanical replacement. Either the seal lip is worn down or the seal is hardened and cracked from old age, heat and ozone. What happens is exactly as we described above. If you have a very old engine that has been running petroleum oil, and it also leaks, for example around the rear-main oil seal, then chances are it will leak more with synthetic oil. This is commonly referred to a false seal. AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils are recommended for use in mechanically sound engines! If you have a vehicle that leaks oil excessively, then repair the seal prior to converting to AMSOIL.

What I find sort of comical is the statement that Synthetics don't cause leaks...., It's like saying I put 3000# of weight on an old 1000# scale, but the weight didn't cause the thing to break, it was a worn part.

 

Synthetic oil does have a lot of additives. That's why it's so expensive. It's doesn't compute that dino oils companies would put the same cost of those additives into non-synthetics.

I'll stand by my statement earlier, without smiling, and recommend dino oils for the 1stGen Ventures.

[Squeeze]

,,,

I'll stand by my statement earlier, without smiling, and recommend dino oils for the 1stGen Ventures.

 

I back you up. It doesn't make Sense at all. Dino Oil for a 1Gen, also keeps the Clutch in Shape and not slipping.

[lonestarmedic]

Well, I guess I am a minority. I run Mobile 1 15W50 in my 1986. I don't have leaks. My clutch grabs as tight as ever. The motor pulls strong and I don't notice the temp gauge going up quite as far as it did with dino oil. Coincidence or not. I will point out that this particular oil is not an energy conserving oil. Before this I always used Castrol 20W50 in warm weather and a 10W40 in cold weather. I will say that I believe motorcycle specific oils seem to be overpriced. I know a lot of folks using Rotella T 15W40. I bet there are a huge pile of bikes running Rotella with fantastic results.

 

JB

[hig4s]

When you use a petroleum oil for a long period of time, a varnish-like deposit forms on the walls and other surfaces of the inside of your engine. If you have ever seen the inside of an engine, I'm sure you have noticed it. This varnish material is not sludge, but is a brownish coating. It doesn't much matter what brand of oil you have been using, it still forms, although it might vary in color. This coating will tend to cover the seals in the engine. The most critical are the front and rear main seals and the valve guide seals. This coating keeps the oil from contacting the seals, which will cause the seals to dry out and shrink. A seal will swell as much as 10%. This is an important factor in keeping an engine tight and free of leaks.

In the 1970's when synthetics were new, the seals were not all made of the same materials and some synthetics treated them differently. If you where ever into an old Chevy small block from the early 1960's, they used a piece of rope as a rear seal. Now seals are all pretty much the same stuff, regardless of the vehicle manufacturer, and the various oil manufacturers know what they are dealing with and have overcome any adverse or inconsistent seal swelling.

Anyway, anytime you change oil brands, and it doesn't have to be from conventional petroleum oil to a synthetic oil, it can be from one conventional petroleum oil to another brand name petroleum oil, the fact that each oil has a different chemical make up will often remove this varnish. Synthetics are, of course, different and will usually lift this coating off. Synthetics, since they are formulated to last longer for extended drains, has a high amount of detergent/dispersant additives and will clean the inside of an engine. When this coating is removed, it re-exposes the seal. Often, the build-up of varnish was providing a seal, or "false-seal", and by removing the coating, the seal will start to leak oil. On really high mileage engines, like over 150,000 miles for gas, and 600,000 miles for diesels, the seal may have cracked. This seal will obviously keep leaking. But in most cases, the seal will re-swell after 500-1,000 miles and stop leaking.